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getting a Ripped stomach Rate Topic: -----

#16 User is offline   H.y 

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 01:59 PM

View Postjudogido, on 05 February 2012 - 05:22 PM, said:

Therefore that is the last, most stubborn place fat will remain no matter how many crunches you do and how many ab-magic machines you buy at 2am in the morning.


Well shoot. No wonder.


Anyone wanna buy a shakeweight?
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#17 User is offline   Neil G 

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 02:35 PM

View PostIppon_Seoi_Nagi, on 05 February 2012 - 07:26 PM, said:

lol @ "how many ab-magic machines you buy at 2am in the morning"
my biggest problem is just what to eat, recently i been making food at home that seems decent/healthy to me and staying away from fast foods
If you really want to cut, it's not enough just to eat what seems right. You need to know how much you're eating and how much you are exercising. There are lots of tools to do that. Online you can check out places like myfitnesspal.com, they also have a great iphone app (may come for android, not sure). It's a pain in the ass tracking all this stuff but if you don't do it you will be clueless as to whether or not you are eating too much. As far as nutrition, most people recommend at least 0.8 g protein per lb of lean bodyweight if you are trying to gain muscle or cut without losing too much muscle. Again, some tracking software is useful in letting you know if you have enough protein. Most people have a tough time getting that much through their normal diet, so you may have to look at whey shakes or the like or alternately a lot of chicken...
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#18 User is offline   CARLO 

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 03:04 PM

You could always have implants like this guy :big grin: :ph34r:

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#19 User is offline   Matthew Jones 

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 06:41 PM

You need to:

1. Have very low bodyfat.
2. Take diuretics so you are dehydrated.
3. Have makeup applied to define your stomach more and/or photoshop the pictures.

Here's the big secret, that's what these guys do, don't think this type of fakery is only for women.

Just get strong and leave the vanity stuff for others.
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#20 User is offline   Allen 

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 11:16 PM

Abs are made in the kitchen, plain and simple. Training is a small part of achieving that low bodyfat. Abs show from low bodyfat (below 10% and sometimes as low as 8 or 6% for most males). The only way to get body fat that low is consistent proper eating. That means lots of plain foods, and not a lot of refined and processed stuff. WIth careful calorie control you'll get lean enough to see your abs.
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#21 User is offline   Ippon_Seoi_Nagi 

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 11:22 PM

View PostAllen, on 06 February 2012 - 03:16 PM, said:

Abs are made in the kitchen, plain and simple. Training is a small part of achieving that low bodyfat. Abs show from low bodyfat (below 10% and sometimes as low as 8 or 6% for most males). The only way to get body fat that low is consistent proper eating. That means lots of plain foods, and not a lot of refined and processed stuff. WIth careful calorie control you'll get lean enough to see your abs.



What if you eat regular kitchen made food (not 100% healthy) but control the portions and the calories? WIth great exercise attached to that, dont u think that would get me abs?
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#22 User is offline   7thCuil 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 10:47 AM

View PostMatthew Jones, on 07 February 2012 - 04:41 AM, said:

Just get strong and leave the vanity stuff for others.


:manoyes: I second this.

But if you really want that kind of muscle definition and are ready to put in the effort, time and hunger for what
are almost purely aesthetic benefits, it's your choice. Good luck!


Lyss

EDIT- That time and energy could, of course, be better spent on training in Judo...

This post has been edited by Lystra: 07 February 2012 - 10:49 AM

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#23 User is offline   Neil G 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 02:16 PM

View PostIppon_Seoi_Nagi, on 06 February 2012 - 05:22 PM, said:

What if you eat regular kitchen made food (not 100% healthy) but control the portions and the calories? WIth great exercise attached to that, dont u think that would get me abs?
Possibly. I don't know what you look like, but I'll take a wild guess and say you're looking at dropping 40+ lbs to get there - is that what you want?
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#24 User is offline   genetic judoka 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 02:50 PM

another thing to consider, if you're looking to lose A LOT of weight to gain said six pack, is the extra skin you'll have. that makes a 6 pack difficult unless you have a row of clothes pins down your ribs.
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#25 User is offline   Ippon_Seoi_Nagi 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 03:02 PM

View PostNeil G, on 07 February 2012 - 06:16 AM, said:

Possibly. I don't know what you look like, but I'll take a wild guess and say you're looking at dropping 40+ lbs to get there - is that what you want?


Like 20 pounds mate I'm not chubby just a little gut
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#26 User is offline   Ippon_Seoi_Nagi 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 03:03 PM

View Postgenetic judoka, on 07 February 2012 - 06:50 AM, said:

another thing to consider, if you're looking to lose A LOT of weight to gain said six pack, is the extra skin you'll have. that makes a 6 pack difficult unless you have a row of clothes pins down your ribs.


Good point. But that's never been a issue cause I'm not that big.
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#27 User is offline   kuma 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 03:10 PM

View PostNeil G, on 05 February 2012 - 07:36 PM, said:

That's not the way it works. Bulk up first, then cut to get the 6 pack. There's no way to bulk up without also adding fat. You're already bulked so you need to cut. There's also no way to cut and not lose muscle, but you can minimize the amount of muscle lost by eating lots of protein and lifting heavy. Getting below 10% and staying there is harder than most people want to do. If you enjoy feeling starved all day, every day for the sake of vanity go for it.


+1

I actually gave up on this. If I were you, I'd rather train for functionality.
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#28 User is offline   Neil G 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 03:21 PM

View PostIppon_Seoi_Nagi, on 07 February 2012 - 09:02 AM, said:

Like 20 pounds mate I'm not chubby just a little gut
If you would be sub-10% at 5'11" and 200 lbs, you already have a world-class physique and wouldn't be asking these sorts of questions. I don't think you understand just how low a target sub-10% bodyfat is. If you're really curious, go to a good gym and get measured with calipers. I think you'll be surprised how high it is.
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#29 User is offline   Ippon_Seoi_Nagi 

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 03:23 PM

View PostNeil G, on 07 February 2012 - 07:21 AM, said:

If you would be sub-10% at 5'11" and 200 lbs, you already have a world-class physique and wouldn't be asking these sorts of questions. I don't think you understand just how low a target sub-10% bodyfat is. If you're really curious, go to a good gym and get measured with calipers. I think you'll be surprised how high it is.



I do have a good body lol. It's just that gut area ( too many beers ) I'll check my body fat though
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#30 User is offline   Cichorei Kano 

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 01:21 AM

View PostIppon_Seoi_Nagi, on 05 February 2012 - 10:45 AM, said:

in the past i have tried super hard to get a 6 pack but i simply cant, ive only reached a 2 and thats with flexin. I was wondering if anyone knows any good tips on dieting or supplements. Im 220 , 5'11
what did shred some fat of my stomach was just running but then that made me slim down completely and i like my body kinda big, just want a toned stomach


Your question really isn't about judo but about fitness or cosmetics, but very well.

What constitutes a ripped stomach:

1. Sufficiently solid vertical abdominal muscles
2. Sufficiently low subcutaneous fat, and no excessive intraabdominal visceral fat
3. sufficiently tight an undamaged skin
4. no underlying cachexic disease such as cancer or Aids

You're not going to get any of that through consuming whatever supplement, including proteins. Whether caloric restriction is necessary is not automatically so at all. The information provided by your body mass and height is of limited use without any data about lean body mass or proportion of body fat, and an idea about your age, your current musculature, and the health of your skin.

One can't say you have to drop down to this or that percentage of body fat; in fact it's even absurd, since percentage of body fat is genetically determined. There are percentages one cannot get even if one tries to starve themselves whereas there are people who can maintain such body fat percentages without any dieting or even excessive training. There are jûdôka around with 1-2% of body fat standard; there are others who will sustain considerable musculo-skeletal injuries from the moment they go down as 'far' as 10%, and we are just talking males. If body fat dips below your genetically acceptable level it will be accompanies by all kinds of problems. It's not a good indication to use for achieving a 6-pack though obviously at its most extreme there does exist a connection. In that context it is unlikely any male with a 20% body fat percentage will have a visible 6-pack just like it is unlikely that a male with 1-2% of body fat will not have a visible 6-pack (unless suffering from a cachexic [body mass- & muscle-wasting] disease.

A major problem in developing a 6 pack is that one cannot exercise that area like one can exercise one's legs or shoulders. You can do running or biking for an hour hence submitting your quadriceps and biceps femoris to constant isotonic contractions, but you can't do uninterrupted aerobic isotonic contractions of your abdominals for an hour. That muscle fibertype is not suited for lengthy aerobic exercise. Thus it is hard to locally burn fat. This means that usually in that region you will only start losing fat when your overal fat dips below a certain threshold. This threshold is genetically determined and different for every person. Loss of body fat is nonlinear and non-equally distributed, so it is impossible to predict in you unless one has excessive records from previous attempts.

You can do lots of sit-ups. This will contribute to having solid abdominal muscles. It won't have a dramatic effect on burning your fat, but ... there is some link, in that the more lean body mass the more oxygen you might be able to exract from the air. Indeed there is a link to VO2 and lean body mass, for obvious reasons. So, having good abdominals will contribute to the amound of oxygen you can extract using muscles from that area, and thus how long and how hard you can train. Its direct effect on subcutaneous fat will be limited, but it may not be negligable if your sustain that training long enough, i.e. daily for at least a year to 2 years.

While it isn't easy to lose subcutaneous fat in that area, it is even more difficult on the hips and on your back at that level. And mainting lots of fat on the hips and at the back will exert a negative effect on the visibility of your 6-pack at your front. It is also for that reason that the most effective way to get rid of all that fat is through liposculpture. This is obviously surgery and comes at a price. However, it is the only way one can effectively spot-reduce fat and to a much greater extent in particular at that location. Whether that is recommended for what it is you want to achieve, is something else, and the result also depends on the quality of your skin and the skill of the surgeon. That being said, the combined effect of surgery and training probably can give the best possible result. There is a physiological reason for this, namely the potential formation of a thin fibrotic layer between the fat and the muscle due to the surgery. The visibility of the scars also depends on your genetics and skin quality.

Someone suggested bulking up and then reducing fat. Whilst that may sound achievable in theory, the other way around is far more effective that is lose maximal weight and then buil up selecively. It is not true that one cannot gain weight without gaining fat.

The issue of calories is another matter. It is not directly relevant to your problem. Losing weight and what you eat is not the same. You lose weight when your nitrogen belance or energy balance is negative. That is also obvious. That means if you are eating nothing else but French fries and double cream and ice cream you will still lose weight as long as you burn more calories than what you eat. Practically, no doubt, since which such products you have a high caloric contents for a small volume of food, it is more effective to reach your goal to choose foods with a high volume and low caloric contents and which are healthy, and contain less noncomplex sugars. That is when talking weight and maximal weight loss. It is a different matter when one talks in terms of maximizing performance and energy, but anyhow.

As pointed out before, consumption of proteins has little to do with it. Because of the high energy required to burn protein and the complex nutritional process, they are of limited importance in this discussion. It is also with amino acids and proteins that unless your body is conditioned to absorb them (typically requires specific training, diet and timing of diet consumption) a large part will end up in the loo. There are some minor problems in that proteins are the most expensive food and far more expensive in general than fat or carbs, which is historically also one of the reasons next to Darwininan reasons, why proteins make up a much smaller proportion of our diet than carbs and fat.

Using a combination of anabolic steroids and growth hormone will also significantly help. They assist through multiple mechanisms, including the reduction of fat, and through enhancing nitrogen retention, through stimulation of amino acid metabolism, and gene expression, to an extent that is impossible to achieve through mere physical training. I point out that their use may be illegal depending on local law and sports rules and whether you are a member of organized sport or visitor of a public sports facility. Use without medical supervision may seriously damage your health short- and long-term, and have legal consequences. Me indicating what their physiological effect is with regard to your question should not be construed as me advising you to try this out, nor that I would personally condone such use. I only provide scientific advice, not moral or legal advice.

Before you take everything for granted, mind that if you have any stretchmarks in that area, this indicates damaged skin and that will significantly change the equation.

Good luck !
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