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a question for the serious kata competitors out there Rate Topic: -----

#1 User is offline   genetic judoka 

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 03:41 AM

to those of you who compete in kata regularly, I'm wondering: when you practice, is the same person always tori, or do you switch back and forth? what about when you compete? thanks.
"Let the refining and improving of your own life keep you so busy that you have little time to criticize others." -H. Jackson Brown Jr.

"Wise men don't need to prove their point. Men who need to prove their point aren't wise" -Lao Tzu

"When torrential waters move a massive boulder, it is because of momentum.
When a hawk’s strike breaks the body of its prey, it is because of timing." -Sun Tzu

"The Way of strategy is the Way of nature. When you appreciate the power of nature, knowing the rhythm of any situation,
you will be able to hit the enemy naturally and strike naturally. All this is the Way of the Void." -Miyamoto Musashi
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#2 User is offline   danguy 

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 03:50 AM

View Postgenetic judoka, on 06 January 2012 - 07:41 PM, said:

to those of you who compete in kata regularly, I'm wondering: when you practice, is the same person always tori, or do you switch back and forth? what about when you compete? thanks.


Kata is generally done this way:

It is good to learn both uke and tori.

For promotion kata demonstration in the USA all except for NNK must be done as tori. NNK can be performed as either uke or tori with uke considered a bit more difficult.

For competition, you pair and practice in the manner that makes you look best as a pair. You both need to try uke or tori (well most of the time) to see which is the best way for the pair. Then you practice and practice.

This post has been edited by danguy: 07 January 2012 - 03:51 AM

If I am doing "win," sloppy and sissy is fine; if I am doing Judo, beautiful is my rule and goal. Judo is far more important and rewarding than "win."

"What you are as a person is far more important than what you are as a basketball [Judo] player." --John Wooden 1910-2010

"You should first try to negotiate nicely but you can be strong after there's resistance, and know, just like in judo, when to catch them." --Rusty Kanokogi, 2008, on negotiating.
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#3 User is offline   billc 

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 04:31 AM

View Postgenetic judoka, on 06 January 2012 - 07:41 PM, said:

to those of you who compete in kata regularly, I'm wondering: when you practice, is the same person always tori, or do you switch back and forth? what about when you compete? thanks.


Girlfriend getting a little bit boring, young man?
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#4 User is offline   Kelly 

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 04:32 AM

It’s a bit of both for us. We switch occasionally in practice – both of us want to know how to do both sides at a competent level, and so we trade to make sure we keep sharp. As well, doing the opposite side (such as doing uke when you’re usually tori) helps in the learning your own usual role – you appreciate what each role does better.

For Kata competition, however, we stay in one role. The main reason for us is that we chose these roles earlier on due to a particular reason – physical (for example, I am uke in Goshinjutsu as my partner has very tight shoulders, and so simply cannot bend his shoulders enough to adequately receive some of the locks), or preference (my partner flat out refused to do the knee walking for Katame no Kata :big grin: ! Fortunately I wanted to!), or a desire to do a particular part (I really enjoy the weapon work in both Goshinjutsu and Kime no Kata, and so wanted to be Uke in each so that I could do more). The reasons we originally chose the roles still remain, and so for most of our practices we stay in those roles

regards,
Kelly

This post has been edited by Kelly: 07 January 2012 - 04:33 AM

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#5 User is offline   Link 

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 05:28 AM

I'm not a serious kata competitor as in doing the kata for points, but whenever I do enter a kata tournament locally I do quite well. I'm usually tori but I like to be uke to know how to improve my role as tori. This also works the same way for uke when being tori. I'm found out practicing this way improves our overall kata.
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#6 User is offline   makoto 

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 10:04 PM

I'm a retired competitor, but we followed a routine similar to what Kelly stated. When practicing "in between" tournaments, we practiced both roles as we felt that was important from the standpoint of the art. But when we were training for a competition, we stuck with the roles that we competed in. Training time can be limited, or at least never as much as we thought we ideally would have liked to prepare for a major competition, so we wanted to make sure we were maximizing our practices to (hopefully) produce the best competition results. Figured that was still consistent with the principle of "maximum efficiency; minimum effort"! ;wry)
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#7 User is offline   danguy 

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Posted 08 January 2012 - 05:00 AM

View Postbillc, on 06 January 2012 - 08:31 PM, said:

Girlfriend getting a little bit boring, young man?


He no longer has that wonderfully beautiful woman as a girlfriend....:wub: :wub: :wub:



:hap:

This post has been edited by danguy: 08 January 2012 - 05:00 AM

If I am doing "win," sloppy and sissy is fine; if I am doing Judo, beautiful is my rule and goal. Judo is far more important and rewarding than "win."

"What you are as a person is far more important than what you are as a basketball [Judo] player." --John Wooden 1910-2010

"You should first try to negotiate nicely but you can be strong after there's resistance, and know, just like in judo, when to catch them." --Rusty Kanokogi, 2008, on negotiating.
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#8 User is offline   genetic judoka 

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Posted 08 January 2012 - 08:53 AM

thanks for the answers everybody. it was much along the lines of what I expected to hear.

and yes bill, the girlfriend was getting boring. so I made her a fiance instead.
"Let the refining and improving of your own life keep you so busy that you have little time to criticize others." -H. Jackson Brown Jr.

"Wise men don't need to prove their point. Men who need to prove their point aren't wise" -Lao Tzu

"When torrential waters move a massive boulder, it is because of momentum.
When a hawk’s strike breaks the body of its prey, it is because of timing." -Sun Tzu

"The Way of strategy is the Way of nature. When you appreciate the power of nature, knowing the rhythm of any situation,
you will be able to hit the enemy naturally and strike naturally. All this is the Way of the Void." -Miyamoto Musashi
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#9 User is offline   Ben Reinhardt 

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Posted 08 January 2012 - 11:28 AM

View Postgenetic judoka, on 08 January 2012 - 12:53 AM, said:

thanks for the answers everybody. it was much along the lines of what I expected to hear.

and yes bill, the girlfriend was getting boring. so I made her a fiance instead.


So how did you make her do that?

Congatulations, though, please post video of the wedding on JF. You'll be wearing your judogi, of course?
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#10 User is offline   genetic judoka 

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Posted 08 January 2012 - 06:03 PM

View PostBen Reinhardt, on 08 January 2012 - 06:28 AM, said:

So how did you make her do that?

Congatulations, though, please post video of the wedding on JF. You'll be wearing your judogi, of course?

apparently all it takes is clever trickery, and a well timed waki gatame.

I don't think she'll like the judogi idea, but i will of course be videoing the ceremony (which won't be for a while) it's not unreasonable to think a highlight video might make it to the misc section
"Let the refining and improving of your own life keep you so busy that you have little time to criticize others." -H. Jackson Brown Jr.

"Wise men don't need to prove their point. Men who need to prove their point aren't wise" -Lao Tzu

"When torrential waters move a massive boulder, it is because of momentum.
When a hawk’s strike breaks the body of its prey, it is because of timing." -Sun Tzu

"The Way of strategy is the Way of nature. When you appreciate the power of nature, knowing the rhythm of any situation,
you will be able to hit the enemy naturally and strike naturally. All this is the Way of the Void." -Miyamoto Musashi
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#11 User is offline   Tafftaz 

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Posted 08 January 2012 - 06:19 PM

A friend of mine who won a silver at the world kata championships told me "at that level you are tori or uke,you can't be both". He also told me that uke is more important than tori. I have never competed at a kata tournament, but have been encouraged to do so. Maybe in a year or two,with a lot more practise :hap:
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#12 User is offline   bob thomas 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 04:20 PM

View PostTafftaz, on 08 January 2012 - 06:19 PM, said:

A friend of mine who won a silver at the world kata championships told me "at that level you are tori or uke,you can't be both". He also told me that uke is more important than tori. I have never competed at a kata tournament, but have been encouraged to do so. Maybe in a year or two,with a lot more practise :hap:

I will be looking out for you.
Bob
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#13 User is offline   Tafftaz 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 05:24 PM

View Postbob thomas, on 09 January 2012 - 04:20 PM, said:

I will be looking out for you.
Bob


I will let you know well beforehand so I can introduce myself :manoyes:
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#14 User is offline   Neil G 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 06:58 PM

The two guys I know who compete seriously always do the same roles, but they switch from one kata to the next. For example, the one who is uke for nage-no-kata may be tori for ju-no-kata.
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#15 User is offline   aiyotsu 

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 09:15 AM

View Postgenetic judoka, on 08 January 2012 - 08:53 PM, said:

thanks for the answers everybody. it was much along the lines of what I expected to hear.

and yes bill, the girlfriend was getting boring. so I made her a fiance instead.

Congratulations .
Good move .
Cherish her and never let her feel she is a Judo widow.
kind regards
aiyotsu
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