JudoForum.com: how many reps do i need in weight training? - JudoForum.com

Jump to content

  • (3 Pages)
  • +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

how many reps do i need in weight training? Rate Topic: -----

#31 User is offline   Neil G 

  • Judo Forum Ikkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 466
  • Joined: 25-March 11

Posted 11 January 2012 - 06:56 PM

View Postkuma, on 11 January 2012 - 12:42 PM, said:

Interesting. I would definitely try that.

Also, how long do you rest? (not in between sets but in between workout days. I was told that 3 days should be optimal)
I think it's up to you. I rested for 1 minute between sets, lots of guys say longer but I usually just didn't have that kind of time.

I don't think you need 3 days rest between workout days. I'm not lifting right now but when I was it was 3 days/week for about 45 minutes each time, so 1 or 2 days rest only. Some guys do every day but switch body parts. However pretty much every exercise I did was whole body so that didn't apply to me.
0

#32 User is offline   Gant 

  • Judo Forum Ikkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 483
  • Joined: 03-July 08

Posted 11 January 2012 - 10:40 PM

View Postkuma, on 11 January 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

Darshu, Neil G and SilverJudo, Thanks for the clarifications and advices. Yeah, I always did my weight lifting in a very slow, almost negative rep kind of way. Straining in motion is a good way to describe it. I was advised in the gym to not lift "explosively" since it will be more beneficial to lift slow and HARD. I increased my power and I do look more "muscular" now because of this but yeah, lost my speed.(Ironically, I am flabbier and heavier back then, but I am faster) I am adjusting everything now that I am back in Judo.

Thanks again people!


You did not increase your power, despite what you might have perceived. You do not increase explosiveness by exaggerating the eccentric portion of the lift. Glad you got squared away.
Your physiology doesn't care what your philosophy is.

Practical Strength for Trainers
0

#33 User is offline   genetic judoka 

  • Honorary Forum Woohooshidan
  • Icon
  • Group: Moderators
  • Posts: 2,949
  • Joined: 08-February 11

Posted 12 January 2012 - 12:38 AM

View PostGant, on 11 January 2012 - 05:40 PM, said:

You did not increase your power, despite what you might have perceived. You do not increase explosiveness by exaggerating the eccentric portion of the lift. Glad you got squared away.

thank you for beating me to it. power can be defined as work done per unit time. if one can lift 500 pounds but it takes them 20 seconds to do it, and another can lift only 250 pounds but it only takes them 5 seconds to do it, the second person is twice as 'powerful'
"Let the refining and improving of your own life keep you so busy that you have little time to criticize others." -H. Jackson Brown Jr.

"Wise men don't need to prove their point. Men who need to prove their point aren't wise" -Lao Tzu

"When torrential waters move a massive boulder, it is because of momentum.
When a hawk’s strike breaks the body of its prey, it is because of timing." -Sun Tzu

"The Way of strategy is the Way of nature. When you appreciate the power of nature, knowing the rhythm of any situation,
you will be able to hit the enemy naturally and strike naturally. All this is the Way of the Void." -Miyamoto Musashi
0

#34 User is offline   kuma 

  • Judo Forum Yondan
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 2,392
  • Joined: 28-May 04

Posted 12 January 2012 - 01:20 AM

View Postgenetic judoka, on 12 January 2012 - 09:38 AM, said:

thank you for beating me to it. power can be defined as work done per unit time. if one can lift 500 pounds but it takes them 20 seconds to do it, and another can lift only 250 pounds but it only takes them 5 seconds to do it, the second person is twice as 'powerful'


Oh, so what is the correct term then? I became stronger? I am not really timing my lifts. When I said I became powerful, I mean that I can lift something heavier for the same number of reps. Maybe my lifting technique improved?
My Judo Blog - Judo Kouro - My Judo Journey

Judoforum's Mizuno Owners Club member #1
Mizuno Owner? Join the club!
Be carefull, have lots of stamina, fight like a tiger, and be as strong as a bull.
0

#35 User is offline   Darshu 

  • Judo Forum Sandan
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 1,693
  • Joined: 01-March 05

Posted 12 January 2012 - 03:00 AM

View Postkuma, on 11 January 2012 - 07:20 PM, said:

Oh, so what is the correct term then? I became stronger? I am not really timing my lifts. When I said I became powerful, I mean that I can lift something heavier for the same number of reps. Maybe my lifting technique improved?

I'm sure you got stronger. It is a matter of correct terminology. Power has an element of speed as well as strength. Getting stronger gives you more potential to have more power, but you have to move fast to develop that potential.
John Schneider
JudoFitness.com

Quote

1. The Body is One Piece
2. There are three kinds of strength training:
• Putting weight overhead
• Picking it off the ground
• Carrying it for time or distance
3. All training is complementary.
-Dan John
0

#36 User is offline   genetic judoka 

  • Honorary Forum Woohooshidan
  • Icon
  • Group: Moderators
  • Posts: 2,949
  • Joined: 08-February 11

Posted 12 January 2012 - 03:11 AM

View Postkuma, on 11 January 2012 - 08:20 PM, said:

Oh, so what is the correct term then? I became stronger? I am not really timing my lifts. When I said I became powerful, I mean that I can lift something heavier for the same number of reps. Maybe my lifting technique improved?

well, I wasn't suggesting getting out a stopwatch. the point I was making is that since your posts are about losing a lot of speed even though you got stronger, it was not a power increase. splitting hairs? maybe.
"Let the refining and improving of your own life keep you so busy that you have little time to criticize others." -H. Jackson Brown Jr.

"Wise men don't need to prove their point. Men who need to prove their point aren't wise" -Lao Tzu

"When torrential waters move a massive boulder, it is because of momentum.
When a hawk’s strike breaks the body of its prey, it is because of timing." -Sun Tzu

"The Way of strategy is the Way of nature. When you appreciate the power of nature, knowing the rhythm of any situation,
you will be able to hit the enemy naturally and strike naturally. All this is the Way of the Void." -Miyamoto Musashi
0

#37 User is offline   TAMUjudo 

  • Judo Forum Rokkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 12
  • Joined: 19-July 08

Posted 12 January 2012 - 03:36 AM

View Postajajudo, on 21 March 2011 - 09:17 PM, said:

hi guys, im doing weights for my training in Judo. Our school gym instructor gave us a program but it's all high reps around 10-12 reps per exercise. I was wondering, would it be better if i settled for low reps but heavier weights? thanks very much for the advice!


Crossfit.com

Try this. I know many Judo, MMA, athletes that believe that crossfit works best for them.
0

#38 User is offline   kuma 

  • Judo Forum Yondan
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 2,392
  • Joined: 28-May 04

Posted 12 January 2012 - 02:46 PM

View Postgenetic judoka, on 12 January 2012 - 12:11 PM, said:

well, I wasn't suggesting getting out a stopwatch. the point I was making is that since your posts are about losing a lot of speed even though you got stronger, it was not a power increase. splitting hairs? maybe.


:D Got it!

I'll find a happy medium to become powerful then. Maintain strength and train for speed.
My Judo Blog - Judo Kouro - My Judo Journey

Judoforum's Mizuno Owners Club member #1
Mizuno Owner? Join the club!
Be carefull, have lots of stamina, fight like a tiger, and be as strong as a bull.
0

#39 User is offline   Tranquil1 

  • Judo Forum Rokkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 22
  • Joined: 10-February 12

Posted 10 February 2012 - 09:06 PM

View PostTAMUjudo, on 12 January 2012 - 03:36 AM, said:

<br />Crossfit.com<br /><br />Try this. I know many Judo, MMA, athletes that believe that crossfit works best for them.<br />
<br /><br /><br />

Works best for them relative to what? And 'best' meaning what?
0

#40 User is offline   Gant 

  • Judo Forum Ikkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 483
  • Joined: 03-July 08

Posted 21 February 2012 - 04:15 PM

View PostTranquil1, on 10 February 2012 - 03:06 PM, said:

<br /><br /><br />

Works best for them relative to what? And 'best' meaning what?


Meaning that they floundered about with non-specific training, got very tired, sat in a pool of sweat, lost some weight, and concluded that they became fitter.

CF "specializes" in not specializing. It is a GPP "sport." Judo is a sport that looks and "feels" GPP to untrained observer. Very different.

CF, done properly, with good form, and, for the most part, without the stupid clock, can be fine for developing GPP--which covers many tools in the judoka's toolbox--for the recreational judoka. Off-the-shelf CF for the competitive judoka is not optimal. One could argue that CF methods can be applied for judo training. And one could respond that those methods worthy of sport development have been around for decades.

If you want to do some worthwhile CF, take workouts from 2006-2008 and do them without the clock (2-3 days a week), reducing the weight as necessary.
Your physiology doesn't care what your philosophy is.

Practical Strength for Trainers
1

#41 User is offline   Tranquil1 

  • Judo Forum Rokkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 22
  • Joined: 10-February 12

Posted 21 February 2012 - 10:17 PM

View PostGant, on 21 February 2012 - 04:15 PM, said:

Meaning that they floundered about with non-specific training, got very tired, sat in a pool of sweat, lost some weight, and concluded that they became fitter.

CF "specializes" in not specializing. It is a GPP "sport." Judo is a sport that looks and "feels" GPP to untrained observer. Very different.

CF, done properly, with good form, and, for the most part, without the stupid clock, can be fine for developing GPP--which covers many tools in the judoka's toolbox--for the recreational judoka. Off-the-shelf CF for the competitive judoka is not optimal. One could argue that CF methods can be applied for judo training. And one could respond that those methods worthy of sport development have been around for decades.

If you want to do some worthwhile CF, take workouts from 2006-2008 and do them without the clock (2-3 days a week), reducing the weight as necessary.


Ha! That was what *I* thought was likely but I wanted to see if they'd given any rational beyond, "Do CF, bro!". ;)

I was talking about this thread w. my friends that do CF over the weekend and about the quantifying training effects on sports. They told me I was "obsessed" and then followed up with, "You guys should start doing Crossfit!".

I've thought for a while that the earlier WODs and some of the named workouts are all fine for building anaerobic power and capacity, but I've also read the general ability to improve those traits is fairly limited and can be done (and then maintained) with a great deal less volume. So then why "CF" workouts as opposed to, as you imply, just 'workouts' designed to effect\enhance certain training parameters?

I also think that CF at present does a lot more SPP work, in effect, skill training, across a wide wide variety of movements, such that performing well in some WODs is much more about SPP (ie, if you are good at 'the Ranger hitch' climbing ropes is a lot easier than if you're doing it all upper body, snatch + double-under workouts are much easier\possible if you have those two skills) than GPP. But I don't do "CF" so what do I know?

Mostly tho just wondering if the prior posters instructors had reasons for recommending CF. :)
0

#42 User is offline   Tranquil1 

  • Judo Forum Rokkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 22
  • Joined: 10-February 12

Posted 21 February 2012 - 11:11 PM

I've heard folks talk about strength being a learned skill that is fairly specific to the plane of motion. I've heard discussion of rotation as a specific type of strength\power.

Judo, at my low level, seems to have a lot of rotation in it, yet I rarely see anything related to rotational movements in most 'standard' weight lifting routines. Similarly a lot of the angles used in judo don't seem to conform to the generally 'flat' angles used in most lifting and there is also an accompanying lack of those types of exercises in most weight lifting routines I see suggested for the average amateur athlete.

Anyone have any thoughts on IF those things matter very much for the physical preparation of average club level athletes? And what exercises might be done in the weight room\gym do work those qualities?

I've played around with doing uchikomi with bands for instance. Are there other things out there?

I've seen various sorts of trunk rotational exercises and wonder how you go about loading these training wise. If you're doing a "Russian Twist" http://www.youtube.c...h?v=KtDH26PvGV4 how do you load that? And what sort of rep ranges would be selected? Mostly I've seen those as high(er) rep sorts of "ab work" but if we're training for power...don't we want to not use higher rep work? Or does that not matter since we'd be looking at building speed-strength and thus use a lighter weight\resistance? My understanding is that for power work while the weight might be light relative to a max effort lift the reps per set are still kept low so that intensity can be kept high and fatigue kept lower.

Any ideas on this stuff?
0

#43 User is offline   Darshu 

  • Judo Forum Sandan
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 1,693
  • Joined: 01-March 05

Posted 22 February 2012 - 09:27 PM

View PostTranquil1, on 21 February 2012 - 05:11 PM, said:

I've heard folks talk about strength being a learned skill that is fairly specific to the plane of motion. I've heard discussion of rotation as a specific type of strength\power.

Judo, at my low level, seems to have a lot of rotation in it, yet I rarely see anything related to rotational movements in most 'standard' weight lifting routines. Similarly a lot of the angles used in judo don't seem to conform to the generally 'flat' angles used in most lifting and there is also an accompanying lack of those types of exercises in most weight lifting routines I see suggested for the average amateur athlete.

Anyone have any thoughts on IF those things matter very much for the physical preparation of average club level athletes? And what exercises might be done in the weight room\gym do work those qualities?

I've played around with doing uchikomi with bands for instance. Are there other things out there?

I've seen various sorts of trunk rotational exercises and wonder how you go about loading these training wise. If you're doing a "Russian Twist" http://www.youtube.c...h?v=KtDH26PvGV4 how do you load that? And what sort of rep ranges would be selected? Mostly I've seen those as high(er) rep sorts of "ab work" but if we're training for power...don't we want to not use higher rep work? Or does that not matter since we'd be looking at building speed-strength and thus use a lighter weight\resistance? My understanding is that for power work while the weight might be light relative to a max effort lift the reps per set are still kept low so that intensity can be kept high and fatigue kept lower.

Any ideas on this stuff?

Just because the motion doesn't exactly mimic your sport doesn't mean it doesn't carry over. We are building a bigger, more powerful engine. The gearing, chasis, tires, and fuel you use still have an impact on how fast your car goes. The fundamentals of squat, deadlift, and press- their variations- the Olympic lifts- and Body weight skills are essential to a good S&C program.

Rotational work is good, but doesn't necessarily carry over any better. The only thing that really is going to match the movements of judo is judo, so do more of that and supplement it with the basics. That being said, do some searches for the landmine and bulgarian bags. Those are two of my favorite tools for rotational movements.
John Schneider
JudoFitness.com

Quote

1. The Body is One Piece
2. There are three kinds of strength training:
• Putting weight overhead
• Picking it off the ground
• Carrying it for time or distance
3. All training is complementary.
-Dan John
0

#44 User is offline   kevsooner 

  • Judo Forum Ikkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Special Members
  • Posts: 423
  • Joined: 07-April 07

Posted 08 March 2012 - 05:54 AM

[quote name='Tranquil1' date='21 February 2012 - 04:11 PM' timestamp='1329865895' post='684766']
I've heard folks talk about strength being a learned skill that is fairly specific to the plane of motion. I've heard discussion of rotation as a specific type of strength\power.

Judo, at my low level, seems to have a lot of rotation in it, yet I rarely see anything related to rotational movements in most 'standard' weight lifting routines. Similarly a lot of the angles used in judo don't seem to conform to the generally 'flat' angles used in most lifting and there is also an accompanying lack of those types of exercises in most weight lifting routines I see suggested for the average amateur athlete.

Anyone have any thoughts on IF those things matter very much for the physical preparation of average club level athletes? And what exercises might be done in the weight room\gym do work those qualities?

I've played around with doing uchikomi with bands for instance. Are there other things out there?

I've seen various sorts of trunk rotational exercises and wonder how you go about loading these training wise. If you're doing a "Russian Twist" http://www.youtube.c...h?v=KtDH26PvGV4 how do you load that? And what sort of rep ranges would be selected? Mostly I've seen those as high(er) rep sorts of "ab work" but if we're training for power...don't we want to not use higher rep work? Or does that not matter since we'd be looking at building speed-strength and thus use a lighter weight\resistance? My understanding is that for power work while the weight might be light relative to a max effort lift the reps per set are still kept low so that intensity can be kept high and fatigue kept lower.

Any ideas on this stuff?



"Sport specific" training is poop.

This post has been edited by kevsooner: 08 March 2012 - 05:55 AM

0

#45 User is offline   Tranquil1 

  • Judo Forum Rokkyu
  • Icon
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 22
  • Joined: 10-February 12

Posted 09 March 2012 - 10:12 PM

View Postkevsooner, on 08 March 2012 - 05:54 AM, said:





"Sport specific" training is poop.


What makes you say this?
What's your experience in doing it? Results\lack of results? What sort of programming were you using and how did it work\not work?

Sport specific stuff like judo core training work has seemed pretty helpful to me for application to sport specific stuff.

Just curious as to the factors that go in to your nicely succinct position statement on the issue. :)
0

  • (3 Pages)
  • +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic