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how many reps do i need in weight training? Rate Topic: -----

#16 User is offline   thp 

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Posted 30 March 2011 - 05:37 AM

View PostGant Grimes, on 29 March 2011 - 11:09 AM, said:

I may as well make my semi-annual "rep range" picture post that gets ignored.
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This is great. Thanks for posting. btw your "silliness, madness, death" is not just for laughs: Iowa Football Team Misused Workout
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#17 User is offline   judojohn 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 04:24 AM

View Postsilverjudo, on 29 March 2011 - 08:10 AM, said:

This is incorrect, training in the 8-12 range is hypertrophy training. Look at what any bodybuilder does, and compare that to the low reps that powerlifters and olympic lifters normally train at for max strength.



Better go and research some more Silver- body builders do a lot of different types of training. But for hypertrophy- they use low reps/high weights to muscular failure.
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#18 User is offline   Neil G 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 01:42 PM

View Postjudojohn, on 08 January 2012 - 10:24 PM, said:

Better go and research some more Silver- body builders do a lot of different types of training. But for hypertrophy- they use low reps/high weights to muscular failure.
I think it's your research that's lacking. Even a casual google shows the the common advice is medium reps for hypertrophy.
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#19 User is offline   Ranma 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 05:09 PM

I see a lot of black in the 1-3 rep range!
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#20 User is offline   silverjudo 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 07:49 PM

View Postjudojohn, on 09 January 2012 - 04:24 AM, said:

Better go and research some more Silver- body builders do a lot of different types of training. But for hypertrophy- they use low reps/high weights to muscular failure.


9 months later and where is your argument? This article below goes into more detail than is worth me trying to explain. If you're still unconvinced, search any big name body builder and see their workout routine, for example "Ronnie Coleman's Workout Routine." Nearly every set he works with is 12 reps. And as questioned about Hypertrophy on the grid, note where Sarcoplasmic Hypertrophy is greatest. Though other studies show greater myofbrillar and sarcoplasmic hypertrophy in the 6-12rep range.

http://www.t-nation....an_powerlifters

"Powerlifters generally train in a low rep range (1-5 reps) while bodybuilders tend to favor a moderate rep range (6-12). The adaptations associated with these rep ranges may explain at least part of the hypertrophic differences between these two classes of athletes (Schoenfeld, 2010).

Performing higher reps would theoretically result in a greater hypertrophy of Type 1 fibers. As previously noted, Type 1 fibers are endurance-oriented and thus respond best to longer times under tension. The low-rep training employed by powerlifters simply doesn't allow enough time under tension for significant development of these fibers (Tesch et al. 1984).

...

Moreover, as previously discussed, training in a moderate rep range promotes sarcoplasmic hypertrophy—an increase in non-contractile elements (McDougall, Sale, Elder, & Sutton, 1982; Tesch, 1988). While this in itself manifests as an increased muscle size, it may also promote additional increases in contractile hypertrophy.

...

In a recent study, high reps to failure were shown to be better than low reps to failure for myofibrillar, sarcoplasmic, and mixed protein synthesis (Burd et al. 2010). Although interesting, more research is required as acute protein synthesis doesn't necessarily correlate to greater hypertrophy over time (Mayhew et al. 2009) and previous studies have found very high rep protocols to be suboptimal for increasing muscle growth (Campos et al. 2002).
"
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#21 User is offline   Gant 

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Posted 09 January 2012 - 08:32 PM

View PostRanma, on 09 January 2012 - 11:09 AM, said:

I see a lot of black in the 1-3 rep range!


On my current program, I'll do 5, 10, 15s on kettlebell swings and bodyweight stuff, but my iron work is almost exlusively 1, 2, 3, 5.
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#22 User is offline   Darshu 

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 05:32 PM

View PostGant, on 09 January 2012 - 02:32 PM, said:

On my current program, I'll do 5, 10, 15s on kettlebell swings and bodyweight stuff, but my iron work is almost exlusively 1, 2, 3, 5.

One of my clients noticed recently that we never do 4's. My answer, "I don't know why, we just don't."
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#23 User is offline   kuma 

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 07:44 PM

I guess the main consequence of doing low rep training is that in the long run, you lose your speed. I myself during my non-Judo year did a lot of weight training. When I got back to Judo, I could feel the significant drop in speed and explosiveness. I did bulked up tho.
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#24 User is offline   Darshu 

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 08:06 PM

View Postkuma, on 10 January 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:

I guess the main consequence of doing low rep training is that in the long run, you lose your speed. I myself during my non-Judo year did a lot of weight training. When I got back to Judo, I could feel the significant drop in speed and explosiveness. I did bulked up tho.

Kuma, lifting low reps shouldn't slow you down. Lifting low reps on the slow lifts exclusively could, but if you are doing OWL for low reps, you are moving plenty fast.
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1. The Body is One Piece
2. There are three kinds of strength training:
• Putting weight overhead
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• Carrying it for time or distance
3. All training is complementary.
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#25 User is offline   silverjudo 

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 08:07 PM

View Postkuma, on 10 January 2012 - 07:44 PM, said:

I guess the main consequence of doing low rep training is that in the long run, you lose your speed. I myself during my non-Judo year did a lot of weight training. When I got back to Judo, I could feel the significant drop in speed and explosiveness. I did bulked up tho.


Low rep training does NOT make you lose speed. Not using speed made you lose speed. Low rep heavy weight training increases your strength, which could lay the foundation for improvements in speed and especially explosiveness. But you need to actually train speed and explosiveness specifically, or at least get back into judo again for a while, to improve those areas.

Now if you put on excess bulk and you're too heavy for your own frame, than putting on weight may have made you slower. But try working speed properly with your newfound size and you may find yourself faster, and likely more explosive, than you were a year ago.
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#26 User is offline   Neil G 

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 08:48 PM

View Postkuma, on 10 January 2012 - 01:44 PM, said:

I guess the main consequence of doing low rep training is that in the long run, you lose your speed. I myself during my non-Judo year did a lot of weight training. When I got back to Judo, I could feel the significant drop in speed and explosiveness. I did bulked up tho.
If you are straining through the motion, maybe. I had an S&C coach who advised me to always lift explosively for my training goals (judo, kendo). For example, when doing cleans I should be having to hold onto the bar to keep it from flying out of my hands at the top. He had me doing 3 rep sets.
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#27 User is offline   Gant 

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 10:02 PM

View PostDarshu, on 10 January 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

One of my clients noticed recently that we never do 4's. My answer, "I don't know why, we just don't."


Funny, isn't it? I've tried a couple times, but it just doesn't feel right. 3, good. 5, good. 4...meh.
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#28 User is offline   kuma 

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 02:58 PM

Darshu, Neil G and SilverJudo, Thanks for the clarifications and advices. Yeah, I always did my weight lifting in a very slow, almost negative rep kind of way. Straining in motion is a good way to describe it. I was advised in the gym to not lift "explosively" since it will be more beneficial to lift slow and HARD. I increased my power and I do look more "muscular" now because of this but yeah, lost my speed.(Ironically, I am flabbier and heavier back then, but I am faster) I am adjusting everything now that I am back in Judo.

Thanks again people!
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#29 User is offline   Neil G 

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 05:03 PM

FWIW here's how I was advised to set the weight.

Find your one rep max where it's not the absolute max, but rather the max where you maintain good form and continuous motion through the exercise without having to slow down or strain to get the lockout or whatever. Then take 85% of that (or close as you can get within the limits of the equipment) and use that for reps. If you can't take that weight and have continuous motion through three 3-rep sets, then it is probably still too heavy, go a little lighter. I was doing periodization using 3X3 in recovery weeks, 5X3 in normal weeks and 7X3 in heavy weeks. So it was short sets, but quite a few of them, and again with that explosive feeling. Worked well for me.

This post has been edited by Neil G: 11 January 2012 - 05:04 PM

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#30 User is offline   kuma 

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 06:42 PM

Interesting. I would definitely try that.

Also, how long do you rest? (not in between sets but in between workout days. I was told that 3 days should be optimal)

This post has been edited by kuma: 11 January 2012 - 06:43 PM

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