[kigawman]

Indeed the gi has an advantage. However, my question is this: Does a Judoka benefit by training Judo "Without" the gi?

I have seen many fighters done it. I for one have done Judo without the gi.

Dr. Rhadi Ferguson competed at the ADCC without a gi (of course since its submission grappling)


Can Judo have a Shiai no-gi competion?

This post has been edited by kigawman: 06 November 2009 - 06:57 PM

[revil]

I've done some submission wrestling recently and competed in a tournament. Judo seems to have translated pretty well. All I basically had to figure out were how to grip without a gi, but that wasn't too difficult.

[kigawman]

revil, on Nov 6 2009, 01:57 PM, said:

I've done some submission wrestling recently and competed in a tournament. Judo seems to have translated pretty well. All I basically had to figure out were how to grip without a gi, but that wasn't too difficult.

It has an advantage as well. Jimmy Pedro did Greco-Roman Wrestling and learned how to Capitalize using his upper body rather than a grip. Satoshi Ishii these days is learing the no-gi approach for first MMA match with Yoshida.


I don't see that training without a gi is not-beneficial to a Judoka.

[edward]

kigawman, on Nov 6 2009, 07:02 PM, said:

It has an advantage as well. Jimmy Pedro did Greco-Roman Wrestling and learned how to Capitalize using his upper body rather than a grip. Satoshi Ishii these days is learing the no-gi approach for first MMA match with Yoshida.

I don't see that training without a gi is not-beneficial to a Judoka.

There ain't no way you ain't never gonna benefit from no gi training

[Matthew Jones]

I'm of the opinion that you can absolutely perform Judo without a jacket. The principles of movement of Judo do not require a jacket to be applied. One can perform a seoi nage without a jacket whilst caring for their partner, employing maximum effieciency and undergoing personal development.

[SDjudoka]

kigawman, on Nov 6 2009, 10:55 AM, said:

Indeed the gi has an advantage. However, my question is this: Does a Judoka benefit by training Judo "Without" the gi?

I have seen many fighters done it. I for one have done Judo without the gi.

Dr. Rhadi Ferguson competed at the ADCC without a gi (of course since its submission grappling)
Can Judo have a Shiai no-gi competion?

There are no-gi divisions in AAU freestyle judo.
Sensei Jin Iizumi frequently demonstrates techniques without the gi.

This post has been edited by SDjudoka: 06 November 2009 - 08:08 PM

[kodokanjudo]

kigawman, on Nov 6 2009, 06:55 PM, said:

Indeed the gi has an advantage. However, my question is this: Does a Judoka benefit by training Judo "Without" the gi? I have seen many fighters done it. I for one have done Judo without the gi. Dr. Rhadi Ferguson competed at the ADCC without a gi (of course since its submission grappling) Can Judo have a Shiai no-gi competion?

Yes, many judo techniques can certainly be done without a judogi, but by definition a judo shiai has to be with contestants wearing judogi, just as you need tatami, referees and judo rules.

SDjudoka, on Nov 6 2009, 08:06 PM, said:

There are no-gi divisions in AAU freestyle judo.Sensei Jin Iizumi frequently demonstrates techniques without the gi.

Yes, but the term "judo" in that context is not properly used, as it lacks important elements from Kano's judo.

This post has been edited by kodokanjudo: 06 November 2009 - 08:12 PM

[1point2]

kodokanjudo, on Nov 6 2009, 04:16 PM, said:

Yes, many judo techniques can certainly be done without a judogi, but by definition a judo shiai has to be with contestants wearing judogi, just as you need tatami, referees and judo rules.Yes, but the term "judo" in that context is not properly used, as it lacks important elements from Kano's judo.

Don't leave us hanging.

What are these elements that are missing? It seems to me that he hit all the bases regarding waza and founding principles.

What is this definition of judo shiai that you are referring to?

Finally, what is your personal motivation for resisting no-gi judo?

[stacey]

a gi just gives you easier to find handles.... and lapel chokes

[Tafftaz]

This discussion has been done before.
I honestly believe that there is no such thing as no gi judo only submission wrestling with judo like techniques.
The gi is integral to judo.
Try doing yoko gake without a gi. The kuzushi,tsukuri and kake for this technique is hard enough to perform with a gi. It is nearly impossible without a gi. I have tried.

Now before you all start shouting me down from the rooftops I believe that it is a good thing to practise grappling without a gi sometimes.
Notice I said grappling and not judo.

This is just my opinion.

[marlinspike]

Tafftaz, on Nov 6 2009, 02:20 PM, said:

This discussion has been done before.
I honestly believe that there is no such thing as no gi judo only submission wrestling with judo like techniques.
The gi is integral to judo.
Try doing yoko gake without a gi. The kuzushi,tsukuri and kake for this technique is hard enough to perform with a gi. It is nearly impossible without a gi. I have tried.

Now before you all start shouting me down from the rooftops I believe that it is a good thing to practise grappling without a gi sometimes.
Notice I said grappling and not judo.

This is just my opinion.

I have to agree with you. Judo without a gi is grappling. Or wrestling. A lot of the throws that I learned in Judo were throws that I learned in wrestling before I even knew judo exists. Does this mean that wrestling is Judo also. I think the gi is what makes it judo as opposed to a different type of wrestling. Less face it though all grappling arts are pretty similar and elements of all of them do cross over into the others. I would say it would be beneficial to learn how to throw without a gi. It will deffinately help with judo I would think. What if you can get a grip on a wrist and throw from there even though you can't get a grip on the gi. It is still a throw non the less.

[1point2]

Tafftaz, on Nov 6 2009, 05:20 PM, said:

This discussion has been done before.
I honestly believe that there is no such thing as no gi judo only submission wrestling with judo like techniques.
The gi is integral to judo.
Try doing yoko gake without a gi. The kuzushi,tsukuri and kake for this technique is hard enough to perform with a gi. It is nearly impossible without a gi. I have tried.

Now before you all start shouting me down from the rooftops I believe that it is a good thing to practise grappling without a gi sometimes.
Notice I said grappling and not judo.

This is just my opinion.

I've toyed with this idea myself.

Then again, no-gi BJJ didn't exist until some BJJ practitioners created it. They had to make a conscious choice to have no-gi practices in BJJ, and not just cross-train submission wrestling. Judo could do the same thing. I doubt it will become widespread, but it's possible.